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Old 17 Aug 2020, 06:45 AM   #31
ioneja
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Yep, and complaints on Reddit too. Looks intermittent, or at least not hitting every region. I can still connect here, but what's troubling to me too is that there is no response as of yet from Tutanota. So I think this is probably the end of the line for me with Tutanota. They should be replying at the very least, explaining they are still under attack, or whatever, etc.... The complaints started coming in over an hour ago, nope, actually reading through Reddit looks like it's been going on and off for various people in Europe, Canada, Estonia, UK, Brazil, +more, for 6+ hours, and more. No reaction from Tutanota.

So farewell Tutanota, this lack of communication isn't going to work for me. I'll come back and check them out in a year or two to see if they made any changes. For now, I've lost my desire to trust them with anything important.

Thank goodness I didn't move any domains over. Wow.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 06:50 AM   #32
evfrson
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Tutanota just carrying on as if nothing is really happening. I really feel for the people who can't get their emails for over 24 hours.

Its at times like this you realise how good Fastmail is which is why I am going to consolidate my requirements with them.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 07:05 AM   #33
ioneja
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It is unfortunate. I'm also disappointed, as I was really starting to like these guys enough to start to rely on them more. I'd be very upset right now if I had anything critical on there. So for now, at least, I'm done. And I wish them all the best in figuring out their next steps. But the lack of public response and transparency is IMO inexcusable. No matter what the real situation is on the ground and how difficult it is for them right now... someone there can find a few moments to post meaningful updates here and there to reassure their customers.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 07:08 AM   #34
evfrson
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Yes of course.
I was also planning on staying with them for the long term I liked their service but now its back to Fastmail/Signal etc
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 08:22 AM   #35
ioneja
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So this is disturbing if true, looks like there is unexpected port scanning going on from a Tutanota IP address, suggesting the possibility of a hack?

See: https://www.abuseipdb.com/check/81.3.6.164

Also https://www.reddit.com/r/tutanota/co...ta_got_hacked/

And continued reports of up/down service on other Reddit threads.

And still no comment from Tutanota staff.

If this is as serious as the worst case scenario could be, then I'd be pulling all my email out of Tutanota right now TBH just in case. If someone has hacked one of their servers, in addition to the huge DDoS, and on top of that is using one of their servers as a base to start scanning customers' ports, that's pretty bad news indeed.

Anyway, I'll leave it for now, but I thought my last check on Reddit was worth posting about. Best of luck to the Tutanota team, they must be having a nightmare right now.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 04:13 PM   #36
evfrson
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Thanks for that information.

If that is true it is very very serious and would explain Tutanota silence on thus issue.

The problem is the longer this goes on without official comment from Tutanota the worse the situation will get and if/when they do make a comment people will be asking why they left it so long.

Also their nonsense about linking the terms 'blacklist' and 'whitelist' to Black Lives Matter and replacing these terms with what they see as more neutral and less offensive terms has annoyed a LOT of people on Twitter.
Maybe if they had spent less time virtue signalling and focusing on their business instead, they wouldn't be in this mess.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 10:09 PM   #37
ioneja
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Tutanota finally posted in Reddit about the possible hack, saying, "Thanks for reporting. We are not hacked, it's more likely an attack against us with forged IPs. We'll get in contact with blacklist."

That's a relief, but not completely -- why did it take 14 hours to respond to something like that? Not to mention how slow they are to reach out to get delisted from the blacklist, pretty low priority apparently. And they are still blacklisted as of this post. And BTW it also doesn't explain some of the shady-looking domains that resolve to that IP either, not to mention no further post about the huge DDoS attack, not to mention they're still apparently under attack with no further comment or reassurance or any kind of transparency or PR awareness, while they carry on business as usual (and allow their service to continue to be blacklisted). Anyway, last update from me on this thread, as I'm over and out from Tutanota, will delete my account.

Last edited by ioneja : 17 Aug 2020 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 17 Aug 2020, 11:39 PM   #38
evfrson
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Strange that Tutanota use the term blacklist. I thought they found the term offensive acording to one of their recent tweets.
Yes I'm out of there too and it is good to be back at Fastmail.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 07:18 AM   #39
TenFour
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Within the last hour from Tutanota:

Quote:
Tutanota
@TutanotaTeam

1h
We're back online, sorry again.
Quote Tweet

Tutanota
@TutanotaTeam
1h
We are under another DoS attack and working on mitigating this already. We apologize for this inconvenience.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 04:02 PM   #40
alexu2007
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From the moment I saw that Tutanota is down I moved my domains to Yandex. I use Cloudns Premium and the changes I make in DNS settings are propagated almost instant. The privacy is not so important for me (because I do not trust protonmail, tutanota or any other encrypted email provider), for sensitive information I always manually encrypt the files with 7z, but the uptime and reliability is very important.

It's not the first Tutanota outage. In the last 6 months I noticed that it was down several times for short periods of time - around 30 minutes or so. But it was the biggest outage I experienced with them until now.

If a downtime do happen, I want to know what is going on, and this without having to dig the internet for posts on reddit or twitter (I don't use twitter, I found their post searching on google for info regarding their outage). I want to know what is going on, what they do to fix it and an estimate how long it will take. I understand that dealing with DDOS attacks it's very hard to predict when the service is going to be restored, but even a rough estimate will do.

Tutanota, I'd like to see a status page hosted on a different server, with a different hosting company and I'd like to see updates every 30 minutes in case of an outage, even if you don't have new info to communicate. Tell us that you are there and what you are doing to fix it.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 04:32 PM   #41
evfrson
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Agree entirely with what you have said.

I too have an uneasy feeling about these smaller encrypted email providers, I always think they are honeypots.

Also they have to have a mechanism in place to give authorities access to unencrypted email to comply with court orders (which Tutanota have done in the past according to reddit). So what is to stop them using this mechanism whenever they want to ? Nothing.

All these services rely on trust and like you I don't trust them.

I am doing pretty much what you are encrypting my own data and using Internxt to share it to my contacts.
For email I am just using Fastmail and GMail whose service has been outstanding the past few years and secure messaging with SIgnal.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 05:43 PM   #42
alexu2007
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Regarding privacy, I think that at this moment Signal is the gold standard for secure communications. Let's hope it will last as it is now.

But for mail I had some past negative experiences that led me to lose my trust in services that can access your information. Protonmail and Tutanota, both have recovery keys that in my opinion compromise the basic of end to end encryption.

So, for me Tutanota is just another email provider. However, the fact that those shady domains resolved to their IP is worrying. There should be a public explanation for that.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 07:53 PM   #43
TenFour
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I am always amazed that email services don't send their customers an email to explain a crisis like this one. Instead, they follow the current tech trend of providing no information other than cryptic Tweets occasionally interspersed with irrelevant messaging about something else. The death of customer service is near universal, so I suppose no tech company feels they have to do better than any other. I worked for a tech company for awhile that charged premium prices, but also provided premium service. We had a rule that a real person had to answer the phone within three rings every time someone called, even if it wasn't for you. More than once I was there when the CEO of the company answered and spoke to a client. It was rather humorous if we were having a meeting or something to see everyone scrambling if multiple lines started ringing. We always had designated people answering during meetings.
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 10:24 PM   #44
TenFour
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Cloudflare reports a big increase in DDoS attacks this year. https://datacentrenews.eu/story/ddos...udflare-report
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Old 18 Aug 2020, 11:51 PM   #45
TenFour
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Update from Tutanota: https://tutanota.com/blog/posts/update-ddos-attack/
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