AJAX filing, deleting, new mail

mentiro · 31 Oct 2006, 04:05 AM

I would love to see Fastmail support some AJAX-enabled features that enhance usability. I don't necessarily care if Fastmail supports it to the extent of Gmail or Yahoo, but I specifically think the following features' usability could be greatly improved using AJAX:

Filing messages into folders
Deleting messages
Checking for new mail automatically

Similar functionality could easily be envisioned for mark read, flag, report spam, and other operations that act on e-mails and require the whole page to reload currently.

It drives me crazy sometimes waiting for FM to reload the whole page after some of these actions, and really has started and will continue to make FM feel dated compared to its competitors if they don't start adopting this technology into their interface.

I have seen several other posts related to AJAX, but most people are just shouting "FM should create an AJAX interface" I'm not looking for FM to overhaul their interface, but I think that using AJAX for specific features could greatly enhance the ease-of-use and decrease the wait-times of managing your e-mail boxes.

Also, these features could be made optional so that you could enable or disable these features depending on your browser and preference.

Finally - I know this one has been asked for forever - but let me go ahead and mention that I'd love a google-like search for all of my e-mails. The more e-mail I accumulate in FM, the more valuable this feature would be. I know there are serious technical hurdles to building this feature, but I think that to continue to compete - FM must seriously consider it.

Berenburger · 31 Oct 2006, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mentiro
Finally - I know this one has been asked for forever - but let me go ahead and mention that I'd love a google-like search for all of my e-mails. consider it.

I've been waiting for ages for Google's conversation view!

mentiro · 31 Oct 2006, 04:29 AM

Yeah - that's a good use as well. I've seen threads where a lot of FM users were against changing the interface, but I think that a few Gmail-inspired changes could do wonders for FM.

I don't think it would even be all that difficult for a lot of these changes, especially if they provided the existing version as an option, similar to Google's Basic view.

drchadwick · 31 Oct 2006, 04:58 AM

I've been hoping for some meaningful enhancements to the interface for years. For something that bills itself as "fast", this is a kludgy, slow interface for managing mail. The slowness comes not so much from waiting for things to happen, but from having to jump through hoops to make things happen. A few of the biggest bugs, interface-wise:

> search across folders: M.I.A.

> message threading: it's 2006. I have much better things to do than hunt down the previous messages in an exchange. At home, I let OS X Mail do it for me. On Gmail, it's purely automatic. Please, make it an optional enhancement.

> Mailboxes other than "sent items" display the sender only, so for every message you've sent, you just see your own name instead of who you sent it to. This is useless. Why not a smart to/from field?

> Sort a mailbox however you want (by date, sender, flag), but go away from it and come back, and it will be sorted by date again. Have fun re-sorting it over and over and over.

> seriously, would an optional preview pane in mailbox view be so bad? (optional means you can turn it off, by the way)

> it takes two clicks and combing through a menu to flag a message. This should be able to happen by clicking in the "flag" field. (Oh, sorry, I forgot the "shortcut": you can also click <ctrl>+<space>, then "F", after you've clicked first to select the message).

But it seems the powers that be and at least the most vocal part of the user base prefer an arcane "power user" interface over something more polished. People here will tell you how much they love typing some arcane keystroke combo to flag a message. Or how message threading would destroy the earth.

This will permanently remain a niche e-mail service until the interface is simplified. Power user features need not be lost, but need to be accessible intuitively. This is what's made Apple's OS a pleasure to work with. Now let's hear from everyone how the command line is superior. *sigh*

If someone combined the power and technical sophistication of this mail service with the accessibility of, say, 37Signals -- then you'd have something great.

hadaso · 31 Oct 2006, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mentiro
... especially if they provided the existing version as an option, similar to Google's Basic view.

What the openning post asked for is not what Google does (proding a stripped down version if you don't used the most up to date browser). What it asked for is to implement more features using AJAX methods (i.e. using javascript to dynamically update the page ond communicate with the server in the background instead of refreshing the page with a new version from the server for each operation).

FastMail already does some things using Javascript when available and transparently reverts to the server side when javascript is not available on the client. They don't do it to the extent Gmail or other AJAX applications do (i.e. they don't when info has to be requested from the server).

Now that one infrastructure project is complete (replication) and another (the domain split) seems to be nearing completion, perhaps there will be more time for interface enhancement.

**Shelded** · 1 Nov 2006, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Berenburger
I've been waiting for ages for Google's conversation view!

I hope we all die waiting for that at Fastmail.

**Shelded** · 1 Nov 2006, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by drchadwick
> search across folders: M.I.A.

> Mailboxes other than "sent items" display the sender only, so for every message you've sent, you just see your own name instead of who you sent it to. This is useless. Why not a smart to/from field?

> Sort a mailbox however you want (by date, sender, flag), but go away from it and come back, and it will be sorted by date again. Have fun re-sorting it over and over and over.

> seriously, would an optional preview pane in mailbox view be so bad? (optional means you can turn it off, by the way)

> it takes two clicks and combing through a menu to flag a message. This should be able to happen by clicking in the "flag" field. (Oh, sorry, I forgot the "shortcut": you can also click <ctrl>+<space>, then "F", after you've clicked first to select the message).

Most your ideas would be welcome, or at least somewhat harmless (why preview pane? open another tab). There's nothing wrong with this remaining a successful niche email service for geeks, either. And it's not so kludgy since it runs in a browser window and often multiple tabs get things done (does Yahoo Beta do that?).

However, message threading is a threat to humanity.

I put stuff all in *one* folder (Trash) and the search is adequate for the task. Never empty the trash.

drchadwick · 1 Nov 2006, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shelded
(why preview pane? open another tab).

Because I need another tab to keep track of like I need a hole in the head. I suspect others do too. Sick of opening yet another tab/window to see what a message is before I deal with it. This is basic e-mail functionality.

Quote:

However, message threading is a threat to humanity. I put stuff all in *one* folder (Trash) and the search is adequate for the task. Never empty the trash.

If your mail organizing practices are that primitive, you may as well be using PINE or whatever. Leave the discussion of actual organizing features to those who might use them and enjoy your giant mail folder.

mentiro · 2 Nov 2006, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shelded
However, message threading is a threat to humanity. I put stuff all in *one* folder (Trash) and the search is adequate for the task. Never empty the trash.

Wow - I can't imagine moving everything into one folder and never being able to empty my Trash. So - let me get this straight - being able to do a global search is useless, because we should file all of our email in Trash and search through it there? Can anyone really think that is a good solution, or are you just trolling?

mentiro · 2 Nov 2006, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hadaso
They don't do it to the extent Gmail or other AJAX applications do (i.e. they don't when info has to be requested from the server).

Exactly - not using Javascript(AJAX) to request or send information from the server rather than reloading the entire page is what makes Fastmail feel slow and clunky compared to its competitors.

Believe me - I appreciate Fastmail keeping page sizes smaller so that the web pages load very fast - but that's no substitute for being able to flag/delete/file messages without reloading the page.

hadaso · 2 Nov 2006, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mentiro
... - but that's no substitute for being able to flag/delete/file messages without reloading the page.

This kind of Javascript magic seems like something Rob would very much like to do. Google had the advantage that they started from scratch.

31 Oct 2006, 04:05 AM	#1
mentiro Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 37	AJAX filing, deleting, new mail I would love to see Fastmail support some AJAX-enabled features that enhance usability. I don't necessarily care if Fastmail supports it to the extent of Gmail or Yahoo, but I specifically think the following features' usability could be greatly improved using AJAX: Filing messages into folders Deleting messages Checking for new mail automatically Similar functionality could easily be envisioned for mark read, flag, report spam, and other operations that act on e-mails and require the whole page to reload currently. It drives me crazy sometimes waiting for FM to reload the whole page after some of these actions, and really has started and will continue to make FM feel dated compared to its competitors if they don't start adopting this technology into their interface. I have seen several other posts related to AJAX, but most people are just shouting "FM should create an AJAX interface" I'm not looking for FM to overhaul their interface, but I think that using AJAX for specific features could greatly enhance the ease-of-use and decrease the wait-times of managing your e-mail boxes. Also, these features could be made optional so that you could enable or disable these features depending on your browser and preference. Finally - I know this one has been asked for forever - but let me go ahead and mention that I'd love a google-like search for all of my e-mails. The more e-mail I accumulate in FM, the more valuable this feature would be. I know there are serious technical hurdles to building this feature, but I think that to continue to compete - FM must seriously consider it.

31 Oct 2006, 04:29 AM	#3
mentiro Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 37	Yeah - that's a good use as well. I've seen threads where a lot of FM users were against changing the interface, but I think that a few Gmail-inspired changes could do wonders for FM. I don't think it would even be all that difficult for a lot of these changes, especially if they provided the existing version as an option, similar to Google's Basic view.

31 Oct 2006, 04:58 AM	#4
drchadwick Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 179	I've been hoping for some meaningful enhancements to the interface for years. For something that bills itself as "fast", this is a kludgy, slow interface for managing mail. The slowness comes not so much from waiting for things to happen, but from having to jump through hoops to make things happen. A few of the biggest bugs, interface-wise: > search across folders: M.I.A. > message threading: it's 2006. I have much better things to do than hunt down the previous messages in an exchange. At home, I let OS X Mail do it for me. On Gmail, it's purely automatic. Please, make it an optional enhancement. > Mailboxes other than "sent items" display the sender only, so for every message you've sent, you just see your own name instead of who you sent it to. This is useless. Why not a smart to/from field? > Sort a mailbox however you want (by date, sender, flag), but go away from it and come back, and it will be sorted by date again. Have fun re-sorting it over and over and over. > seriously, would an optional preview pane in mailbox view be so bad? (optional means you can turn it off, by the way) > it takes two clicks and combing through a menu to flag a message. This should be able to happen by clicking in the "flag" field. (Oh, sorry, I forgot the "shortcut": you can also click <ctrl>+<space>, then "F", after you've clicked first to select the message). But it seems the powers that be and at least the most vocal part of the user base prefer an arcane "power user" interface over something more polished. People here will tell you how much they love typing some arcane keystroke combo to flag a message. Or how message threading would destroy the earth. This will permanently remain a niche e-mail service until the interface is simplified. Power user features need not be lost, but need to be accessible intuitively. This is what's made Apple's OS a pleasure to work with. Now let's hear from everyone how the command line is superior. sigh If someone combined the power and technical sophistication of this mail service with the accessibility of, say, 37Signals -- then you'd have something great.