FastMail Wiki

Onno · 7 Jan 2003, 07:45 PM

To enhance user interaction further, we've created the FastMail Wiki . A WikiWikiWeb is a site where everyone can collaborate on the content. Basically, if you see a spelling error and would like to correct it, or you would like to add some content, you can!

We would like to make this a central place where features can be suggested and then finetuned by all users. Hopefully it will also relieve some of the feature request clutter that is apparent in this forum. Users can also submit examples of working Sieve code, or provide tutorials and walkthroughs for the service. If you'd like to see other categories, go ahead and add them!

Now go have a look at how to use the Wiki and experiment!

redmyrlin · 7 Jan 2003, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Onno
...Now go have a look at how to use the Wiki and experiment! [/b]

Oh dear

, just had a look and a quick play in the sand box

- and just when I thought my fastmail addiction was on the wane, along comes Wiki to waken it up again!!

**Gankaku** · 7 Jan 2003, 08:58 PM

The Sandbox is a good idea so people can practice posting.

I would be interested in seeing a bunch of the Sieve examples posted so that I can learn it. It'd be easier to see it in one spot, then searching and digging through millions of EMD threads to find the script. This is a good idea.

Can we have a .CSS section there too??

Onno · 7 Jan 2003, 09:05 PM

Sure! Add it!

**Gankaku** · 7 Jan 2003, 09:18 PM

Done!

jwyfchan · 7 Jan 2003, 10:03 PM

The wiki is an excellent idea. I've used quite a number of them for mid-size project in intranets and they've worked quite well. It really captures the collective knowledge of just about everyone involved.

An excellent move, FM! Well done.

**ReuvenNY** · 7 Jan 2003, 10:30 PM

It is probably a great collaboration tool for the more technical people among us. It is too technical for me. Yes, I can learn how to use this system, but I’ll feel like a programmer of sorts...
I feel very comfortable when I can simply type in anything I have to say, like on this forum. Actually, in a way Wiki is a form of either duplication or replacement of this forum. Think about it! Is there anything significant on Wiki that couldn't have been done here?
Furthermore, it decentralizes the information resources: Latest News, Weblog, Forum and now Wiki. Next time when looking for some quick info, I and many others will have to wonder where to turn first, and if we do not find what we need - where next.
Weblog is a logical next step, as it serves as a Latest News REPLACEMENT resource. The Fastmail team can quickly announce and summerize events/issues. The Forum is good for general discussion, collaboration and comments. Wiki? Perhaps I am missing something.
Interesting idea, but I do not think I'll be using it.

P.S. Someone on Wiki brought up a security issue - some disgruntled user can erase the whole site in a flash.

***Edwin*** · 7 Jan 2003, 10:36 PM

I think you've hit the nail on the head - a Wiki is a great Techie tool/toy but the average Joe/Jane has no interest in learning to use one.

The solution may be to restrict Wiki discussions to tech stuff like advanced sieve scripts and the like than non-Techies won't be looking for anyway. Hope the FM team doesn't feel that I'm stepping on any toes by suggesting this!

redmyrlin · 7 Jan 2003, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Edwin
I think you've hit the nail on the head - a Wiki is a great Techie tool/toy but the average Joe/Jane has no interest in learning to use one...

Surely the users will fall into two categories - those who want to help develop a fastmail/email related knowledge base and those who want to find answers to questions. The average Joe/Jane does not have to learn anything new in order to access the knowledge contained in a Wiki - assuming they already know how to use a browser.

If the weblog can be seen as an extension/replacement for the Latest News, then surely the Wiki can be seen as an extension/replacement for the FAQ?

Onno · 7 Jan 2003, 10:53 PM

Quote:

If the weblog can be seen as an extension/replacement for the Latest News, then surely the Wiki can be seen as an extension/replacement for the FAQ?

I will echo Edwin's nail/head here (in a completely different context).

blog: serves the purpose of centralizing uncluttered news to FM users. It will soon update all latest news automatically, thereby un-muddling the previous messy structure of having news in emails, the forum and sometimes the latest news.

wiki: serves the purpose of (hopefully) automatically generating some FAQ entries that we don't want in the FAQ. Basically, things like Sieve editing are not features we want to actively support. You don't HAVE to contribute. The cool thing is that you CAN.

Reuven: I understand it seems daunting, but really, just hit Edit on any page and change whatever you want. There's no coding involved, just typing.

Edwin: I think you know you don't have to worry (nor anyone else) about stepping on our toes. We're all here to discuss and try to improve the FM service, right?

Quote:

Someone on Wiki brought up a security issue - some disgruntled user can erase the whole site in a flash.

Then anyone can put back the latest backup in just as quick a flash.

EDIT: added last quote.

**ReuvenNY** · 7 Jan 2003, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Onno
Someone on Wiki brought up a security issue - some disgruntled user can erase the whole site in a flash.

Then anyone can put back the latest backup in just as quick a flash.

OK, but what if instead of erasing they mass it up, by changing values, removing or adding words etc. in a way that is not immediately noticeable?

Onno · 8 Jan 2003, 12:25 AM

That's possible, and unavoidable. It's still fairly easily noticable by doing a diff on the latest updates.

You seem to be focusing on the negative aspects.

Yes, the system is somewhat open to abuse. However this does give us immense freedom in what to create. Let's just let it evolve for a while and see what happens...

datherfold · 8 Jan 2003, 01:08 AM

Hello:

I have tried Wiki and it looks like it will prove to be a very useful tool. But I have a question please. What if two people are doing an edit (on the same page) at the same time, and one person does a save, a few seconds after another person. Will the first save be lost? Or is this not possible?

Dave

lmg · 8 Jan 2003, 02:53 AM

Quote:

It is probably a great collaboration tool for the more technical people among us. It is too technical for me. Yes, I can learn how to use this system, but I’ll feel like a programmer of sorts...

It's not so bad. After a while you'll start to like the taste of Jolt Cola and Szechuan food.

SanjaySheth · 8 Jan 2003, 04:01 AM

The Wiki is a good place to store some misc stuff that we have discussed over the past few months like tutorials on building Fastmail style sheets, various example Sieve spam filters, possible ideas for interface improvements, and a user-updatable list of requested features.

I imagine most discussion about these various things would still be occur on this forum but the Wiki would be where the long example script would be posted with a link from the discussion here back to the wiki page.

7 Jan 2003, 07:45 PM	#1
Onno Cornerstone of the Community Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 753	FastMail Wiki To enhance user interaction further, we've created the FastMail Wiki . A WikiWikiWeb is a site where everyone can collaborate on the content. Basically, if you see a spelling error and would like to correct it, or you would like to add some content, you can! We would like to make this a central place where features can be suggested and then finetuned by all users. Hopefully it will also relieve some of the feature request clutter that is apparent in this forum. Users can also submit examples of working Sieve code, or provide tutorials and walkthroughs for the service. If you'd like to see other categories, go ahead and add them! Now go have a look at how to use the Wiki and experiment! Last edited by Onno : 7 Jan 2003 at 07:47 PM.

7 Jan 2003, 10:30 PM	#7
ReuvenNY Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: New York Posts: 4,259	My personal opinion on Wiki It is probably a great collaboration tool for the more technical people among us. It is too technical for me. Yes, I can learn how to use this system, but I’ll feel like a programmer of sorts... I feel very comfortable when I can simply type in anything I have to say, like on this forum. Actually, in a way Wiki is a form of either duplication or replacement of this forum. Think about it! Is there anything significant on Wiki that couldn't have been done here? Furthermore, it decentralizes the information resources: Latest News, Weblog, Forum and now Wiki. Next time when looking for some quick info, I and many others will have to wonder where to turn first, and if we do not find what we need - where next. Weblog is a logical next step, as it serves as a Latest News REPLACEMENT resource. The Fastmail team can quickly announce and summerize events/issues. The Forum is good for general discussion, collaboration and comments. Wiki? Perhaps I am missing something. Interesting idea, but I do not think I'll be using it. P.S. Someone on Wiki brought up a security issue - some disgruntled user can erase the whole site in a flash.

7 Jan 2003, 08:58 PM	#3
Gankaku Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 3,265	The Sandbox is a good idea so people can practice posting. I would be interested in seeing a bunch of the Sieve examples posted so that I can learn it. It'd be easier to see it in one spot, then searching and digging through millions of EMD threads to find the script. This is a good idea. Can we have a .CSS section there too??

7 Jan 2003, 09:05 PM	#4
Onno Cornerstone of the Community Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 753	Sure! Add it!

7 Jan 2003, 09:18 PM	#5
Gankaku Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 3,265	Done!

7 Jan 2003, 10:03 PM	#6
jwyfchan Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 69	The wiki is an excellent idea. I've used quite a number of them for mid-size project in intranets and they've worked quite well. It really captures the collective knowledge of just about everyone involved. An excellent move, FM! Well done.

7 Jan 2003, 10:36 PM	#8
*Edwin* Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: UK Posts: 3,118	I think you've hit the nail on the head - a Wiki is a great Techie tool/toy but the average Joe/Jane has no interest in learning to use one. The solution may be to restrict Wiki discussions to tech stuff like advanced sieve scripts and the like than non-Techies won't be looking for anyway. Hope the FM team doesn't feel that I'm stepping on any toes by suggesting this!

8 Jan 2003, 12:25 AM	#12
Onno Cornerstone of the Community Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 753	That's possible, and unavoidable. It's still fairly easily noticable by doing a diff on the latest updates. You seem to be focusing on the negative aspects. Yes, the system is somewhat open to abuse. However this does give us immense freedom in what to create. Let's just let it evolve for a while and see what happens...

8 Jan 2003, 01:08 AM	#13
datherfold Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 104	Hello: I have tried Wiki and it looks like it will prove to be a very useful tool. But I have a question please. What if two people are doing an edit (on the same page) at the same time, and one person does a save, a few seconds after another person. Will the first save be lost? Or is this not possible? Dave

8 Jan 2003, 04:01 AM	#15
SanjaySheth Master of the @ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,079	The Wiki is a good place to store some misc stuff that we have discussed over the past few months like tutorials on building Fastmail style sheets, various example Sieve spam filters, possible ideas for interface improvements, and a user-updatable list of requested features. I imagine most discussion about these various things would still be occur on this forum but the Wiki would be where the long example script would be posted with a link from the discussion here back to the wiki page.