Setting default sort per folder

festus77 · 21 Dec 2019, 11:11 AM

A couple questions:

1) Every time I set a folder to "Sort Oldest" it changes back to "Sort Newest" after a little while. I would like this to be permanent. Is this possible?
2) Can I change the default sort on a per folder basis?

#1 is happening on both FastMail.com and the FastMail IOS app. Haven't tried #2 on the IOS app yet.

thanks for your help,
festus

xyzzy · 21 Dec 2019, 04:10 PM

I tried reproducing this by selecting sort "oldest first" on one of my folders and it appears to "stick" for me. I set it, left it alone for a few hours, and it was still set. This was using the webmail interface and I didn't even keep that tab up from the time I set the sort direction to when I went back to check it.

festus77 · 21 Dec 2019, 09:10 PM

Got up this morning and folder was still set to sort oldest (but it hadn't been touched for about 6 hours). Switched to another folder and then back and it now shows sort newest.

n5bb · 25 Dec 2019, 12:05 PM

After some testing, here is what I think is going on:

Fastmail lets you set up any number of browser tabs and windows and mobile devices which are all looking at the same account. At any instant, each of these could be viewing the same folder, or different folders.
Each instance (browser tab or app) maintains a local sort setting for each folder.
So if you send a message which shows up in your Inbox, it might appear at the top of one instance while it appears somewhere else in the list of messages in another instance, depending on the local sort setting at that point in time. In other words, receiving a new message does not cause any change in the local sort order of any instance.
You can not set a default global sort setting for a folder in some special setup screen.
But a global sort order does exist at the Fastmail server for each folder. When you change the local sort order for a folder on a connected browser tab instance or a mobile app instance, the global sort order is immediately updated to your new sorting choice for that folder. If you then open a new instance of a browser tab or mobile app (which connects to the Fastmail server as it starts up), that new instance initially has no local sort settings for the folders, so it inherits the sort settings from the server.
Now here is the tricky part. If you refresh the browser window, it's similar to opening a new instance, and the server folder sort order settings overwrite the previously set sort orders of the local folders.
Changing what folder you are viewing does not directly cause the global sort order to overwrite the local sort order unless the browser data is stale and that window gets a refresh from the Fastmail server. I thing that the triggering event must be a JSON action which refreshes everything rather than just one folder.
Refreshing the folder itself by using the three vertical dot ellipsis tool to the right of the folder name when performing a mouse-over then selecting Refresh only refreshes the messages being displayed and does not reload the sort order from the server.
I don't believe that there is a specific time-out reset for the sort order. But it's possible that some system-wide operation at Fastmail might reset the sort order in all folders to "newest first". But I have seen no evidence of this myself.
My guess is that you had changed the sort order for some folder from a different instance (perhaps the iOS app). Then after many hours when you looked at different folders, the local data was stale and the browser reloaded that window, which reset the sort orders to the global sort orders from the server (which had changed since your last use of that specific instance.

I hope this wasn't too confusing!

Bill

festus77 · 25 Dec 2019, 12:54 PM

Further testing has revealed some new facts. The folder I was most concerned with getting to sort oldest is a Search folder I've saved (is:unread). It still continues to change back to sort newest.

Testing on a bunch of regular (not search) folders shows that regular folders do not seem to switch, only search folders. Not sure what would make them switch though.

Terry · 25 Dec 2019, 04:45 PM

Perhaps its date related...but not sure.

festus77 · 29 May 2020, 09:48 AM

Just wondering if maybe there is something in the actual search criteria I am using could be added to force this folder to always sort oldest first. Maybe something like

is:unread AND sort:oldest

All I want is a folder to show all my unread mail sorted oldest first. The fact that it defaults to newest first just seems to be to Microsoft Outlook'ish.

Thanks,
festus

25 Dec 2019, 12:05 PM	#4
n5bb Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: May 2004 Location: Irving, Texas Posts: 8,923	Global sort order on Fastmail server can overwrite local sort order After some testing, here is what I think is going on: Fastmail lets you set up any number of browser tabs and windows and mobile devices which are all looking at the same account. At any instant, each of these could be viewing the same folder, or different folders. Each instance (browser tab or app) maintains a local sort setting for each folder. So if you send a message which shows up in your Inbox, it might appear at the top of one instance while it appears somewhere else in the list of messages in another instance, depending on the local sort setting at that point in time. In other words, receiving a new message does not cause any change in the local sort order of any instance. You can not set a default global sort setting for a folder in some special setup screen. But a global sort order does exist at the Fastmail server for each folder. When you change the local sort order for a folder on a connected browser tab instance or a mobile app instance, the global sort order is immediately updated to your new sorting choice for that folder. If you then open a new instance of a browser tab or mobile app (which connects to the Fastmail server as it starts up), that new instance initially has no local sort settings for the folders, so it inherits the sort settings from the server. Now here is the tricky part. If you refresh the browser window, it's similar to opening a new instance, and the server folder sort order settings overwrite the previously set sort orders of the local folders. Changing what folder you are viewing does not directly cause the global sort order to overwrite the local sort order unless the browser data is stale and that window gets a refresh from the Fastmail server. I thing that the triggering event must be a JSON action which refreshes everything rather than just one folder. Refreshing the folder itself by using the three vertical dot ellipsis tool to the right of the folder name when performing a mouse-over then selecting Refresh only refreshes the messages being displayed and does not reload the sort order from the server. I don't believe that there is a specific time-out reset for the sort order. But it's possible that some system-wide operation at Fastmail might reset the sort order in all folders to "newest first". But I have seen no evidence of this myself. My guess is that you had changed the sort order for some folder from a different instance (perhaps the iOS app). Then after many hours when you looked at different folders, the local data was stale and the browser reloaded that window, which reset the sort orders to the global sort orders from the server (which had changed since your last use of that specific instance. I hope this wasn't too confusing! Bill

21 Dec 2019, 11:11 AM	#1
festus77 Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Near the Pecos Wilderness, NM Posts: 41	Setting default sort per folder A couple questions: 1) Every time I set a folder to "Sort Oldest" it changes back to "Sort Newest" after a little while. I would like this to be permanent. Is this possible? 2) Can I change the default sort on a per folder basis? #1 is happening on both FastMail.com and the FastMail IOS app. Haven't tried #2 on the IOS app yet. thanks for your help, festus

21 Dec 2019, 04:10 PM	#2
xyzzy Essential Contributor Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 474	I tried reproducing this by selecting sort "oldest first" on one of my folders and it appears to "stick" for me. I set it, left it alone for a few hours, and it was still set. This was using the webmail interface and I didn't even keep that tab up from the time I set the sort direction to when I went back to check it. Last edited by xyzzy : 21 Dec 2019 at 04:22 PM.

21 Dec 2019, 09:10 PM	#3
festus77 Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Near the Pecos Wilderness, NM Posts: 41	Got up this morning and folder was still set to sort oldest (but it hadn't been touched for about 6 hours). Switched to another folder and then back and it now shows sort newest.

25 Dec 2019, 12:54 PM	#5
festus77 Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Near the Pecos Wilderness, NM Posts: 41	Further testing has revealed some new facts. The folder I was most concerned with getting to sort oldest is a Search folder I've saved (is:unread). It still continues to change back to sort newest. Testing on a bunch of regular (not search) folders shows that regular folders do not seem to switch, only search folders. Not sure what would make them switch though.

25 Dec 2019, 04:45 PM	#6
Terry The "e" in e-mail Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VK4 Posts: 3,011	Perhaps its date related...but not sure.

29 May 2020, 09:48 AM	#7
festus77 Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Near the Pecos Wilderness, NM Posts: 41	Just wondering if maybe there is something in the actual search criteria I am using could be added to force this folder to always sort oldest first. Maybe something like is:unread AND sort:oldest All I want is a folder to show all my unread mail sorted oldest first. The fact that it defaults to newest first just seems to be to Microsoft Outlook'ish. Thanks, festus