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Old 4 Dec 2010, 10:38 AM   #1
erimess
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Angry New Interface

I already had the following written up before coming on here. I see there's a rather long thread on the new interface. I chose to start a new one because that one goes clear back to 2008 and I suspect much of what is on there is old and irrelevant at this point in time. I don't have time to read that whole thing, so apologies on the length of this or if I'm just repeating junk.
------------------------------

First, I was unaware of anything about a new interface until I got one of the newsletters in August. It linked to a page that was dated February. On that page, there was a comment about waiting 6-12 months to take away the old interface, after seeing how many folks are still using the old one and why.

First, I do not recall ever seeing anything about a new interface coming up and would like to know where this feedback was happening. I do not have time to spend at the forums or at blogs. That's why I get email updates - I even have it set on chatty. But I never saw a thing until August, after it was already a done deal. So if I wasn't hanging out at the blogs, I don't get to have feedback before it's a done deal, even though I'm PAYING for this?

Supposedly there was some notice for two whole weeks on the login screen. You think everyone really reads stuff on the login screen? I log in. I check my email at least once, if not several times, a day. It's just the same screen. Why should I look at it? I just log in like I always do, mostly absent-mindedly. And I'm a person who actually reads things like TOS's so it's not because I ignore everything.

Now it only shows as a preference in my Options, and a preference I never really even noticed was there. I just go where I want to go and do not go looking down the entire list of preferences in case something new appeared that day.

Tried it back in August. Didn't like it. Went back to the old. Just tried it again, cause I forgot why I didn't like it.

First, can't stand having a column of stuff (like all my mailboxes) down the left hand side of the page when I'm reading and composing. I like to read and compose on a full-screen, or a new screen, or at least a new tab. Yes, I like it cutting off at 72 characters, but not having the whole page in front of me makes me feel "squished." It's fine being over there when I'm just looking at a folder list, but not when I'm composing. And I see no way to change it.

Second, cause I don't have all the style sheets. I see some note about if such-and-such junk exists in your file storage... why would that exist in my file storage? I'd have to put it there. I'd have to know about it before I can put it there. I'd have to know where my file storage is. I'd have to know what the heck you're talking about. I have no clue what those files are, how to get them, and how to make them work. The list of style sheets was a simple list to pick from. I'm not internet ignorant but I know nothing about style sheets.

Since when was this email only for those who are major tech-savvy? So to get a style sheet, now we have to know what we're doing? And no, I don't feel like reading the help files so I can use them. In the old interface they are in a nice, easy drop-down box and I can just pick one.

So I stay with what I'm used to, what has worked for me, and what I like. I like changing the styles, or at least having some kind of option other than some basic standard and "concise." One reason I PAY for this email is cause I like having that kind of flexibility of changing the look, without having to take a crash course on style sheets.

And the default text for "text only" setting sucks and is hard to read. And it's not the Arial I set it on. It's some weird thing that looks like an old dot-matrix printer - and this is what it does when I put it on text. And I like it on text cause it's the only way to get the <'s on quoted text. On HTML it has that line down the side that I don't like. I have a friend who purposely got Fastmail just cause her email wouldn't do <'s on quotes.

If this were free, maybe I wouldn't have a lot of room to talk. But have I mentioned yet that I'm paying for this?

Is this related to Opera taking over? One reason I didn't take advantage of a really good three-year offer when I had the chance was cause I wanted to see what direction this was going to go. If you dump that old interface, I'd have to say you're going in a direction I'm not going to like.
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Old 4 Dec 2010, 11:53 AM   #2
Bamb0
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Just stay on the original one and you will be happy
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Old 4 Dec 2010, 08:59 PM   #3
Pfolson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erimess View Post
Is this related to Opera taking over? One reason I didn't take advantage of a really good three-year offer when I had the chance was cause I wanted to see what direction this was going to go. If you dump that old interface, I'd have to say you're going in a direction I'm not going to like.
Is what related to the Opera takeover, exactly? The new interface? You've seen yourself that work on the new interface goes back to 2008 or earlier. The Opera acquisition of Fastmail was in 2010. It hardly seems likely that they're related.

While I do agree that e-mail communications from Fastmail should be a little more frequent (I can't remember the last time I received an e-mail from FM, and I also have my level set to "chatty"), it's hard to feel sympathy for someone who ignores blog posts, forums, messages on the log-in page, etc., -- who is even aware of the presence of forum threads but "doesn't have the time to read them" -- and then complains that he wasn't kept informed.

If you want to participate and have a say in development, new features, changes, updates, etc., you have to meet halfway and make an effort to find out what's going on, and then make an effort to participate in the discussion. If you don't do that, it's a little unfair to show up several years after the changeover and complain that you had no input.

Or, as the previous poster said, just keep using and enjoying the old interface.

Paul
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Old 5 Dec 2010, 12:21 AM   #4
B4its2L8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erimess View Post
So I stay with what I'm used to, what has worked for me, and what I like. I like changing the styles, or at least having some kind of option other than some basic standard and "concise." One reason I PAY for this email is cause I like having that kind of flexibility of changing the look, without having to take a crash course on style sheets.
I must admit myself that I could have easily been persuaded to stick with the old interface if (for one thing) I could modify the columns in the message list. The message list appearance is too "busy" for my taste (flag, attachment, etc.) I like it in the new interface. Cleaner, crisper and in a more intuitive order ("from" and "subject first, then size). I'm getting used to and liking the new interface.

Now, there are some old interface styles that I'd like to see adapted for the new but I'm way too incompetent about such things to do something like that from scratch. Fortunately, though, with the help of the folks here at EMD -- answering some of my questions and mostly my reading their help given in response to others' questions -- I was able to work my way through getting the files (custom_ui, CSS, JS, tweaks) set up and putting some nice CSS & JS tweaks in there.

But I agree. It would be nice if it wouldn't be so "do-it-yourself." In fact, if this CSS self-service approach is going to continue for some time, it would be nice if FM could simply put all the folders (custom_ui, CSS, etc.) in all FM accounts to begin with, rather than having each and every FM user -- many of whom consider it too intimidating and/or tedious to do such things -- create these file folders for themselves.
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Old 5 Dec 2010, 06:31 AM   #5
Terry
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I agree. It would be nice if it wouldn't be so "do-it-yourself." In fact, if this CSS self-service approach is going to continue for some time, it would be nice if FM could simply put all the folders (custom_ui, CSS, etc.) in all FM accounts to begin with, rather than having each and every FM user -- many of whom consider it too intimidating and/or tedious to do such things -- create these file folders for themselves. [/quote]

That would be a good idea....at least it would be a start.

As it is its like buying a car then being told...oh you have to supply your own wheels.
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Old 5 Dec 2010, 10:35 AM   #6
joe_devore
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I'm still using the old Interface ^_^ Love IT and I only use
Blue Professional 2004 MY Favorite!! ^^_^^
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Old 5 Dec 2010, 08:19 PM   #7
Pfolson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry View Post
As it is its like buying a car then being told...oh you have to supply your own wheels.
I hate to keep sounding like the grumpy old man in this thread, but no, it's not like that at all. FM did not sell you an e-mail service and then tell you, you need to make a bunch of custom modifications in order for it to run. You don't have to know CSS and js tweaks in order to send and receive e-mail, create folders, filter spam, maintain the address book, etc. In fact, you don't have to make any modifications whatsoever in order to obtain all the basic functionality, or to do a whole mountain of advanced stuff available through the option pages.

What's being asked for in this thread is more like buying a car and then deciding you want to change the wheels, modify the suspension, put in a new engine, repaint it, and turn it into a tricked out custom ride. You can do all of that, but hey, you're going to have to do it yourself. You don't expect the company that made the car to create your custom hot rod for you. And you're probably not going to complain about the manufacturer because you need to understand engines (or hire a mechanic) when it's time to make your modifications.

That said, I miss the old menu of style sheets, too. But those styles -- many of which were created by users, not by FM -- were always options. They were the chrome on the wheels, not the wheels themselves.
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Old 5 Dec 2010, 09:07 PM   #8
B4its2L8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pfolson View Post
What's being asked for in this thread is more like buying a car and then deciding you want to change the wheels, modify the suspension, put in a new engine, repaint it, and turn it into a tricked out custom ride. You can do all of that, but hey, you're going to have to do it yourself. You don't expect the company that made the car to create your custom hot rod for you. And you're probably not going to complain about the manufacturer because you need to understand engines (or hire a mechanic) when it's time to make your modifications.

That said, I miss the old menu of style sheets, too. But those styles -- many of which were created by users, not by FM -- were always options. They were the chrome on the wheels, not the wheels themselves.
You're undoubtedly correct ! When I first came to FM I was like a spoiled child, being able to have my pick of interface styles from the stylesheet gallery. I never knew the old interface without that huge list of styles. When the new -- and aesthetically plain -- interface came out I naturally assumed & hoped that it wouldn't be all that long before a gallery displaying a whole new collection of stylesheets would exist, allowing less-than-proficient users (speaking for myself) to have a similar experience of being spoiled as we were with the old one -- including being able to select them from a drop-down menu in FM's options. (For now, though, I'm satisfied with the changes I've been able to make with CSS and JS tweaks.)

But I'm just wondering.... have all those users who were so creative and worked so hard to make those old interface styles moved on to other services ? Are none interested in making new ones or in adapting even the ones they made to the new interface ? (I don't know how hard that would be for the stylesheet designers.)

It's too bad something couldn't be done like what they do with "Personas" for Firefox. Users must produce dozens of new personas every day !! I realize there are millions of users of FF, but it's just the idea of apparently being able to make those personas rather easily.
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Old 6 Dec 2010, 06:47 PM   #9
Drencrom
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I still use the old interface (Infinite blackness). It's been a long time since the new one was introduced and we should have more than just the default stylesheet available by now. Besides, I find many things in the new web interface repulsive (e.g. having to navigate your mouse to a folder to see how many messages it contains).
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 01:29 AM   #10
joe_devore
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drencrom View Post
I still use the old interface (Infinite blackness). It's been a long time since the new one was introduced and we should have more than just the default stylesheet available by now. Besides, I find many things in the new web interface repulsive (e.g. having to navigate your mouse to a folder to see how many messages it contains).
yeah I agree. I asked about that css-tweak too some time ago, one here or from FM got me the Tweak file and showed me where to put it
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 01:38 AM   #11
Drencrom
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I would only bother with this process if someone recreated Infinite Blackness for the new interface. I've been using one and the same stylesheet for almost 9 years. I love it when it's black, easy on the eyes. I use High Contrast Black as a Windows theme too.
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 01:55 AM   #12
Mystakill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drencrom View Post
Besides, I find many things in the new web interface repulsive (e.g. having to navigate your mouse to a folder to see how many messages it contains).
That's one of my most popular tweaks for the new interface, which displays new and total message counts for each folder. This goes under Files in {My Files}/custom-ui/css/tweaks.css:
Code:
/* Display folder message counts */
.messageTotal { display: inline !important }
There are also a few user stylesheets for the new interface posted in the Wiki. I'm not sure why there aren't as many posted for the new interface, but it's possible that many people are fine with a handful of tweaks to the new interface, rather than a complete makeover of the old interface (since that *was* the intent of the new interface).
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 02:11 AM   #13
Drencrom
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Mystakill, thank you for sharing this. Does it work with the default stylesheet as well? I find it a bit confusing still, are there somewhere step by step instructions posted? I think I would need extra help just like joe_devore to get it working.
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 02:21 AM   #14
joe_devore
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drencrom View Post
Mystakill, thank you for sharing this. Does it work with the default stylesheet as well? I find it a bit confusing still, are there somewhere step by step instructions posted? I think I would need extra help just like joe_devore to get it working.


Here is what is in that tweak file::

Code:
Files: {My Files}/custom-ui/css
You will have to create these folders....
custom-ui
then css in custom-ui



Code:
/* Show message counts */ 
.messageTotal { display: inline !important }
File name IS "tweaks.css"

This is the code I was given to make he NEW and Totals display like hey did in the old UI ^_^
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Old 7 Dec 2010, 02:40 AM   #15
Drencrom
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It worked! Thanx a bunch to both of you! At first I just couldn't understand how to insert this code and then I just pasted this in the text document, uploaded it and renamed it. Great!
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