Newbie-Posting Document - Page 2

18 Oct 2004, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Killer
Daniel, FAQ are meant for certain unusual happenings. Common things everyone knows. Like being polite to each others. Too much of the same "FAQ" becomes rules. We know that being nasty is breaking of the rules but some forum allow nasty stuffs. So there is a thin line between FAQ and rules.

I wasn't referring to the forum FAQ; I was referring to the services' FAQs.

I still sometimes see people asking what the SMTP server address is, for example...I don't think it's rude of me to expect most people to find the answer in the FAQ before posting in the forum.

Killer · 18 Oct 2004, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SusanUKF
That is the problem, we need to have enough information, and sometime the surrounding information can give us a better idea of what that person may be able to use (ie: the difference between going free or paid, and so on).

Susan.

Yes, but when is it being given too much or too little informations? Computer speed and ram for something that do with emails? Of couse we won't expect those infos to be relevant but experience users might think those infos holds the answer. So there is no too much or too little. Depend on the problem, the right infomations is needed, which is why people ask them for help here.

Killer · 18 Oct 2004, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kander
8. (General Forum Etiquette) Stay on-topic. If you have an issue that is different from the one being covered in current threads, don't 'hijack' a thread for your issue. Just start a new one.

This point happens with oldies here too. Not just newbies so why aim this at them? No harm done. One thread and split into several other points but if the original poster get his post answered or his post noted, there is no harm here. You are free to bring the post it back on track if it went off topic.

SusanUKF · 18 Oct 2004, 11:40 PM

I think that when new people come here, even if a guidline for posting was here as a sticky thread that it might not get read that often anyway, even if it contains some good information, people just do not generally take the time to read these things.

Look at the number of times that we have had to tell people that advertising, sexual language/links, insulting behaviour , and so on were not permitted. A lot of newbies even fail to read these basic forum rules, let alone guidlines for proper posting!

Susan.

Killer · 18 Oct 2004, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kander

2. Use a meaningful subject. A subject like 'How to send mail with ProviderX' is good, 'HELP! URGENT!!' is not. On a related note, don't label your stuff as URGENT. It tends to look as if you consider your problems to be more important then those of others. Just wait for an answer, like everyone else.

This seems like another "finger pointing" at newbies. I don't think anyone will just type in a help urgent if he doesn't need help. He put in urgent because he is urgently in need of it. It doesn't mean others are not urgent. He just wants others that the problem probably mean his job is at the risk. The details of the topic will be within the thread itself. So far no one uses a Help urgent as a subject as it is simply not the way to post. Until we see such a topic, and if it does happens, it isn't breaking any rules. Just browse at it and help the lost soul or keep it quiet and let someone else help.

SusanUKF · 18 Oct 2004, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Killer
This seems like another "finger pointing" at newbies. I don't think anyone will just type in a help urgent if he doesn't need help. The details of the topic will be within the thread itself. So far no one uses a Help urgent as a subject as it is simply not the way to post. Until we see such a topic, and if it does happens, it isn't breaking any rules. Just browse at it and help the lost soul or keep it quiet and let someone else help.

This is true Killer. I don't think that they necessarily feel that they are more important then anyone else, just that they are in need help right away and are frustrated and so it feels urgent to them at the time. Not everyone knows as much as about computers or email as some people here do!

Susan.

Killer · 19 Oct 2004, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kander
4. Indicate clearly what you want/expect in your answer. If you are looking for advice, say so. If you want a clear yes-or-no answer, tell us.

This sound like a jab at the users that do the answering. If a post is a question or just asking for advice, are we able to differcate it? I myself know when a poster asking for help or advise. Whats wrong with giving advise on a question post? It is just some additional informations you might find useful. This is your call if you think your answers only meant for posts that ask for answers and not advise or other informations.

SusanUKF · 19 Oct 2004, 12:07 AM

If the people are asking questions this is basically self-explanatory, if they don't ask specifically enough then we need to re-ask at times I know, but after they have been here for a while they generally know what is expected of them.

I think when they first come her to post they may be nervous and apprehensive sometimes and need help, period. That is the job of the regulars to guide and help them then, If we throw a lot of guidelines on how to post at them they might feel over-whelmed. They will soon find their way, but reading how others do post and ask questions. That was we still maintain our friendly forum presence that is essential to the forum.

Susan.

Killer · 19 Oct 2004, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Daniel S
I wasn't referring to the forum FAQ; I was referring to the services' FAQs.

I still sometimes see people asking what the SMTP server address is, for example...I don't think it's rude of me to expect most people to find the answer in the FAQ before posting in the forum.

Asking a question such as SMTP is fine. If you have a question just ask. This is a forum. Not everyone knows where to look for an answer. You don't have people asking silly questions all the time.

SusanUKF · 19 Oct 2004, 09:12 AM

I personally feel that the majority of the questions posed on the forum are quite legitimate and that the people actually need help and are seeking resolution to their problems; and that, most often they are answered very quickly, efficiently and in a friendly format. This was certainly the case with me when I first came here, and one of the main reasons that I have stayed on and become such an EMDaholic!!

Susan.

***Edwin*** · 19 Oct 2004, 09:23 AM

I think the intent of the original suggestion is excellent, but in practice it just won't work for the simple fact that people (in general) DON'T READ stuff before posting. I already have probably more than enough stickies since it's clear some folks don't even read the must-read Rules thread!

But the ideas are excellent so perhaps it's worth referring people back to this thread (in a very FRIENDLY way) if they're struggling.

Last thought on the issue: expecting people to search the forums vigorously before they even post once is a nice idea, but in practice it will quite simply never happen. It's a "folorn hope".

Fortunately, the EMD community is such a helpful and friendly group that posters, whether newbies or oldbies, are generally very quickly helped out and given the info they are looking for...

kalashnikov · 20 Oct 2004, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kander
Perhaps it's a bit overkill,

Yes it is, I don't really see the need of this thread. There are so many stickies here already about rules and stuff and I haven't even read them. I've been on many forums and I know how to behave on them. I just follow the etiquette which most forums have and I am fine. Just logical and reasonable thinking of what you can and can't do usually helps you out a lot, unless you have an attitude problem, that is.

Quote:

Originally posted by kander
3. Do your homework. It's pretty annoying to answer questions that can be answered by Googling easily. Also, show that you did your homework, if it's relevant.

Yes Kander, that is very very important.

Quote:

Originally posted by kander
Thank you for your consideration,
Kander

You're welcome.

SusanUKF · 20 Oct 2004, 08:26 PM

Kalashnikov:

You have made some very good points here, especially about the homework! Studying is so important Kander, (and going to classes as well), don't forget this post:

http://www.emaildiscussions.com/...se+in+Activity

Susan.

kalashnikov · 21 Oct 2004, 05:39 AM

By the way, I thought this over and I must say that it's really unnecessary to post stuff like this. To me, this seems like a wannabe-mod/admin action and probably isn't impressing the mods and admin at all.

This board does not belong to you. You might have a high postcount here and helping people out, but that doesn't mean that you're owning the place or should post rules for a forum that you do not own. The admin and moderators already have done that, judging on the amount of stickies on every forum.

You are interfering with admin/moderator jobs which can hinder them in their work. They are not waiting for members to post their rules on the forum with the suggestion that the admin should actually use them.

A forum is managed by the admin(s) and moderators and not by some members who think they are important.

xbot · 21 Oct 2004, 05:43 AM

Maybe you could just make a simple asking a question rule:

-After finishing your post, read it aloud and ensure that the question is at least partially clear, or we won't be able to help you.

18 Oct 2004, 11:40 PM	#19
SusanUKF Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 5,428	I think that when new people come here, even if a guidline for posting was here as a sticky thread that it might not get read that often anyway, even if it contains some good information, people just do not generally take the time to read these things. Look at the number of times that we have had to tell people that advertising, sexual language/links, insulting behaviour , and so on were not permitted. A lot of newbies even fail to read these basic forum rules, let alone guidlines for proper posting! Susan. Last edited by SusanUKF : 18 Oct 2004 at 11:48 PM.

19 Oct 2004, 09:12 AM	#25
SusanUKF Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 5,428	I personally feel that the majority of the questions posed on the forum are quite legitimate and that the people actually need help and are seeking resolution to their problems; and that, most often they are answered very quickly, efficiently and in a friendly format. This was certainly the case with me when I first came here, and one of the main reasons that I have stayed on and become such an EMDaholic!! Susan. Last edited by SusanUKF : 19 Oct 2004 at 09:28 AM.

19 Oct 2004, 12:07 AM	#23
SusanUKF Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 5,428	If the people are asking questions this is basically self-explanatory, if they don't ask specifically enough then we need to re-ask at times I know, but after they have been here for a while they generally know what is expected of them. I think when they first come her to post they may be nervous and apprehensive sometimes and need help, period. That is the job of the regulars to guide and help them then, If we throw a lot of guidelines on how to post at them they might feel over-whelmed. They will soon find their way, but reading how others do post and ask questions. That was we still maintain our friendly forum presence that is essential to the forum. Susan.

19 Oct 2004, 09:23 AM	#26
*Edwin* Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: UK Posts: 3,118	I think the intent of the original suggestion is excellent, but in practice it just won't work for the simple fact that people (in general) DON'T READ stuff before posting. I already have probably more than enough stickies since it's clear some folks don't even read the must-read Rules thread! But the ideas are excellent so perhaps it's worth referring people back to this thread (in a very FRIENDLY way) if they're struggling. Last thought on the issue: expecting people to search the forums vigorously before they even post once is a nice idea, but in practice it will quite simply never happen. It's a "folorn hope". Fortunately, the EMD community is such a helpful and friendly group that posters, whether newbies or oldbies, are generally very quickly helped out and given the info they are looking for...

20 Oct 2004, 08:26 PM	#28
SusanUKF Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 5,428	Kalashnikov: You have made some very good points here, especially about the homework! Studying is so important Kander, (and going to classes as well), don't forget this post: http://www.emaildiscussions.com/...se+in+Activity Susan.

21 Oct 2004, 05:39 AM	#29
kalashnikov Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Nederland Posts: 31	By the way, I thought this over and I must say that it's really unnecessary to post stuff like this. To me, this seems like a wannabe-mod/admin action and probably isn't impressing the mods and admin at all. This board does not belong to you. You might have a high postcount here and helping people out, but that doesn't mean that you're owning the place or should post rules for a forum that you do not own. The admin and moderators already have done that, judging on the amount of stickies on every forum. You are interfering with admin/moderator jobs which can hinder them in their work. They are not waiting for members to post their rules on the forum with the suggestion that the admin should actually use them. A forum is managed by the admin(s) and moderators and not by some members who think they are important.

21 Oct 2004, 05:43 AM	#30
xbot Cornerstone of the Community Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Michigan Posts: 922 Representative of: xxos.us	Maybe you could just make a simple asking a question rule: -After finishing your post, read it aloud and ensure that the question is at least partially clear, or we won't be able to help you.